Monday, January 31, 2011

Prayers Needed for Norman Riley

Norman Riley needs your prayers.  Hospice has begun coming to the home.  Remember him, Louise and their children in your thoughts and prayers.

On this day in 1888...

On this day in 1888, Eliza Jane Riley married Thomas George Price.  They were married at St. Andrews in Bordesley , Warwick, England.  She was the daughter of Ezra and Mary Riley.  She would have been Thomas Roberts Riley's half sister.


It the census records, she is usually listed is LISLE (rhymes with pile or mile).  I am not really sure why she was called this as this is typically a boy's name.


Luckily, we have pictures of these two.

Sunday, January 30, 2011

Sunday Special: Selma's Thoughts on Confirmation


Selma talked in her diary about how important her confirmation was to her.  She is sitting in front of their home in Zanesville in 1912 wearing her confirmation dress.


In her diary (in 1918), she wrote:
It was a beautiful day, and reminded me of the day in which I was confirmed.  There was a very nice class about 25, their examination did not seem very rigid.  I thought when I looked at the seemingly eager, earnest, loving faces, if they would always think the same as they do today.  Oh! If they only would realize the seriousness of it all, the sin which is committed when their vow is broken.  No doubt this morning they were all earnest when they answered affirmative to the vow, if they would only always think the same as they did today....

Saturday, January 29, 2011

DNA and our Ancestors Part I

Ray and Nori had their DNA tested last year by 23 and Me, the company used in the PBS series "Faces of America".  We had some questions about the make up of Nori's paternal ancestry.  Since Nori didn't have any brothers, we couldn't get to the paternal questions unless 23 and Me was used as they test somethings that other companies don't but it's not complete by any means, more of a guess.  They also did the health portion which is of use to our family as well as their sibling's families


So today, we will discuss MATERNAL DNA.  In order to understands what this all means, we need to have a little science lesson, otherwise it won't be clear what we have learned and from what family is concerned.  I will cover this in several blog posts as it is long (and maybe a little boring).   This is from the 23 and Me website:


What is mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA)?

Small structures called mitochondria reside in every cell in your body. Within each of these structures is a tiny circular genome. We call the DNA of this genome "mitochondrial DNA" or "mtDNA" for short.
Mitochondria in cell

Unlike the rest of your genome, mtDNA is only passed on from mother to child; mtDNA inheritance is "maternal," tracking your ancestry through your mother, your mother's mother, your mother's mother's mother, and so on.
mtDNA and family
So to lay this out:


Ray Riley    to    Selma Brueggeman   to   Emma Louise Long     to    Louise Nagel

Using Mitochondrial DNA we are getting the Ancestral Information on Selma's mother and her mother but not her father (Ernst August) and his father (Clamor).  We would need one of Ernst August's grandsons of one of his son's to get to this info.  Or to get to Clamor, one of his son's son's.  In other words, if your last name is still Brueggeman (or Brugge), you would be able to find out about Clamor's Ancestral DNA.

DNA Genealogy

Think this enough for today but I will tease you --- there was a little surprise on Ray's maternal DNA so stay tuned.

Friday, January 28, 2011

Family Picture Friday

Here is a great picture from the 1965 Reunion.  Don't forget you can click on the picture to make it bigger  I haven't done my "thing" yet to identify everyone with a legend.  Sorry.  Looks like the Ernst August children and their spouses.

Thursday, January 27, 2011

Uncle Edward and Aunt Miriam???

Does anyone know who Uncle Edward and Aunt Miriam are?  The only Edward I can find is the eldest brother of Jane Roberts Riley (Thomas Roberts Riley's mother).  Theda Hill sent me the great picture and written on the back says "Uncle Edward and Aunt Miriam and their family".  I have tried researching Edward Roberts but I cannot find one who married a Miriam.  Any ideas???


Wednesday, January 26, 2011

Clamor Ludwig Victor Brueggemann Occupation

On the ship's manifest when CLVB arrived in New York, his occupation was listed as a Joiner.  A joiner is a more specialized carpenter.


According to Wikipedia:

joiner differs from a carpenter in that he or she cuts and fits joints in wood that do not use nails, usually in a workshop environment since the formation of the various joints generally requires non-portable machinery. A carpenter would normally work on site. Cabinet makers who specialise in manufacturing furniture are regarded as producing fine joinery.
The "joinery" and "joiner" usage is obsolete in the USA, although the main carpenters' trade union still calls itself the United Brotherhood of Carpenters and Joiners of America.
A "joiner" would generally produce items such as interior and exterior doors, windows, stairs, tables, bookshelves, etc.

I recently discovered that there is a piece of CLVB's work in exsistence.  Rev. Eugene Brueggeman (son of Rudolph, grandson of Louis)  has a bed that was made by him. He promises to share pictures which I'll share with you.  

Tuesday, January 25, 2011

Free Ancestry Research On-Line

The Mormon Church has an extensive web site that is free to use for searching for information.  I find that I have to use it in connection with other sources (like Ancestry.com).  They don't have facsimiles of the original documents but have enough details  to fill in some info that I need as well as it gives the detail on the microfilm where the record is located.


FAMILY SEARCH

One of the other services is the Wiki* that is a great place to get answers to questions you may have.  It is a great source for the researcher.  Currently, there are over 47,000 articles and a variety of topics.  I have used it for German research questions. Again, another free resource.


FAMILY SEARCH WIKI


*wiki (play /ˈwɪki/ WIK-ee) is a website that allows the creation and editing of any number of interlinked web pages via a web browser using a simplified markup language or a WYSIWYGtext editor.[1][2][3] Wikis are typically powered by wiki software and are often used to create collaborative works. Examples include community websites, corporate intranetsknowledge management systems, and note services. The software can also be used for personal note taking.
Wikis serve different purposes. Some permit control over different functions (levels of access). For example editing rights may permit changing, adding or removing material. Others may permit access without enforcing access control. Other rules can be imposed for organizing content.
Ward Cunningham, the developer of the first wiki software, WikiWikiWeb, originally described it as "the simplest online database that could possibly work."[4] "Wiki" (pronounced [ˈwiti]or [ˈviti]) is a Hawaiian word for "fast".[5]

Monday, January 24, 2011

On this day in 1920...

Thomas Percy Maybury Riley and Jessie Bowen were married in Lake County Indiana.  Tom was the eldest son of Thomas and Elizabeth Riley.  He was 27 years old and had returned from his service in Europe in World War I.  Sorry no age appropriate picture to go with this posting. 


I was verifying this info before I made the posting and I had the place of their marriage wrong. Here is the record and I noticed something very interesting:



Thomas P. Riley
Spouse Name:Jessie Bowern
Marriage Date:24 Jan 1920
Marriage County:Lake
Source Title 1:Lake County Indiana
Source Title 2:Index to Marriage Record 1850 - 1920 Inclusive Vol
Source Title 3:W. P. A. Original Record Located: County Clerk's O
Book:37
OS Page:479


The Works Progress Administration had created indexes. T he WPA began to index vital records, county-by-county for the entire state of Indiana, but the agency was abolished before the indexing was completed. The WPA index includes marriages for eighty-six of the ninety-two Indiana counties.

Sunday, January 23, 2011

On this Day in 1922

On this day in 1922, Russell Krausman was born in Ohio to Louise Brueggeman and Otto Krausman.  He was their first child.  I don't have an earlier picture than this one.

Sunday Special: How the English Riley Family came to be Lutheran

Of course, Selma was raised in a Lutheran family.  Sid Riley's family came to the States from England.  His family was Church of England/Episcopalian until they moved to Dover. Ohio.  There wasn't an Episcopalian Church in Dover at that time.  They joined a Lutheran Church and Sid was confirmed a Lutheran.


At some point after their marriage,  he and Selma joined "The Evangelical Lutheran Church of the Holy Trinity" (aka Holy Trinity) located on North Prospect in Akron.   



Saturday, January 22, 2011

On This Day in 1944...

Russell Krausman (son of Louise Brueggeman and Otto Krausman) married Mary Lois Rogers on this day in 1944.   They were both in the Service.  She was an Air Traffic Controller stateside and he was in the Navy.  Thanks to Donna and David Leigh for the information and picture.

Friday, January 21, 2011

Family Picture Friday

I think on Fridays I will post a family picture from those we've been collecting.  Last week, it was a Brueggeman picture, this week, it's a Riley picture.


This is Sid Riley (on the right) and his long time friend Bill Whittaker (on the left).  Isn't he dapper looking?  They look pretty dressed up to be in what looks like the middle of no where in the middle of winter.

Thursday, January 20, 2011

Thomas Robert Riley II graduates from High School at 15

My Uncle Tom graduated from High School in January of  1953.  Below is the article from the Akron Beacon Journal published on this day.  The headline is wrong, Tom didn't turn 16 until March.  Not only did he graduate at 15, he was also Valedictorian.

Thanks to Theda Hill for the clipping.

Wednesday, January 19, 2011

Thomas Riley and family's home in Akron

Sid's family lived in this house in Akron.  It was a "company home" built by Goodyear.  Ray thinks it is interesting that these English immigrants ended up owning a home that looked very English.  This house is still standing and located at 430 St. Leger Ave in Goodyear Heights.  Here is a picture of the home when the Riley's lived there
It was built in 1918, has three bedrooms, 1.5 baths, and 1196 square feet.  I am amazed that it is valued at only  $68K.  The drive way is to the left and is shared with that house.  It leads to separate garages.  Here is a current picture.


.

Tuesday, January 18, 2011

Ernst August and family's Akron Home

Here is a picture from Selma of the family's home in Akron.  Ernst came up from Zanesville before the family. Selma's diary started a couple of days prior to the move in September of 1917.
The address was:  359 Hickory Street.  Remember, you can click on the picture to make it bigger.  I found it interesting how much land surrounds the house.  The house is no longer standing.  A house that is for sale on the street says that it has a view of Cuyahoga Valley Historical Train Line and is a short walk to Cuyahoga Valley Tow Path hike and bike trail.


Houses directly across the street from the vacant lot are valued between $46K and $58K.  These house have huge lots.  I have no idea what the neighborhood is like now.

Monday, January 17, 2011

Get Well Wishes to Norm Riley

Norm has recently returned home from a stay at the Hospital for some heart surgery.  He is resting at home and is recovering.  I am sure he would appreciate your good thoughts and prayers as well as for his wife, Louise, as she cares for him during his recovery.



More info on Ryley/Riley Surname

It has been thought in our family the Riley was an Irish last name.  As I mentioned last week, the family was originally using Ryley.  I found it used, not only in the 1841 Census, but in baptismal records for the generation of Ezra's mother.  Given the fact that the family was located in Lancashire, I believe it is not Irish but is derived as listed below:


From Surname Database:


This interesting surname is of Anglo-Saxon origin, and is a variant of Riley, which is either of locational derivation from Ryley in Lancashire or Riley in Devonshire, or a topographical name given to someone who lived at the rye clearing. Both the placenames and the topographical terms have the same derivation, that is, from the Olde English pre 7th Century "ryge", rye, and "leah", a wood or clearing. The surname itself is more likely to have originated from the place in Lancashire, as it is most widespread in the North of England. 


Early examples of the surname include: Henry de Ryley, in the Subsidy Rolls of Derbyshire (1327); Johannes de Rylay, in the Poll Tax Records of Yorkshire (1379); and John Ryley, mentioned in the Coroner's Rolls of Nottinghamshire (1488). Sir Philip Ryley (died 1733) was surveyor of the royal woods and forests, having attended the Lord Treasurer of England before 1702, and after 1706, and was knighted in 1728. The family Coat of Arms depicts a fess between three black crosses pattee fitchee on a silver shield, and the Crest being a black dragon's head erased, charged on the neck with three bezants. The first recorded spelling of the family name is shown to be that of John de Ryeley, which was dated 1284, in the "Court Rolls of the Manor of Wakefield", during the reign of King Edward 1, known as "The Hammer of the Scots", 1272 - 1307. 


Surnames became necessary when governments introduced personal taxation. In England this was known as Poll Tax. Throughout the centuries, surnames in every country have continued to "develop" often leading to astonishing variants of the original spelling.

Read more: http://www.surnamedb.com/Surname/Ryley#ixzz1B7daBFU7

Sunday, January 16, 2011

Sunday Special: Concordia Seminary

Most, if not all, of the Lutheran Pastors in the Brueggeman family would have attended Concordia Seminary in Springfield Illinois.  The Missouri Synod had two seminaries, one more theoretical and one more practical for the training of pastors.  


From the 1967 Catalog of the Seminary:


When the German Evangelical Lutheran Synod of Missouri, Ohio, and Other States was organized in Chicago on April 26, 1847,a request was made that the Seminary at Fort Wayne be deeded to the new Synod. This was done, and on September 7, 1847, the
Seminary passed into the control of the Missouri Synod.


At the convention of Synod in 1860, it was resolved that the Seminary at Fort Wayne should be moved to St. Louis, where it would be merged with the church's theoretical seminary. It was felt
that the two institutions could be conducted more economically when combined and that the distinctive character of each seminary could be maintained. The move to St. Louis was made in 1861.
   (I wonder why it left Fort Wayne during the Civil War) 
A second move of the Seminary took place in 1874, when the Synod decided that because of greatly increased enrollments and a growing demand for ministers, two terminal schools would be necessary. One seminary, it was agreed, should have an emphasis on the classical and theoretical approach to ministerial training. This school was to be located in St. Louis. The other seminary should place full emphasis on the practical as acts of kingdom service. Credit belongs to a number of members of Trinity Lutheran Church (this was Charles Long/Lange's church)
of Springfield, who offered to the Synod the piece of property to which the Seminary moved, and on which it is presently located. 


The transfer of the seminary from St. Louis to Springfield took place on September 1, 1875.

Saturday, January 15, 2011

Brueggmann Surname

Since I talked about the Riley surname the other day, I thought it would be good to look into the meaning of the Brueggemann name.  There are so many variations in the spelling that it can make research difficult.  For example. in the 1910 US Census, Ernst August's last name was recorded at Berrygemara by the census taker.  Another year it was recorded as Bruggemann,  and another as Bruggman.   


The German surname of BRUEGGEMANN was both an occupational and locational name meaning 'the dweller and worker at the bridge from residence nearby. Building and maintaining bridges was one of the three main feudal obligations, along with bearing arms and maintaining all the fortifications. The cost of building a bridge was often defrayed by charging a toll, the surname thus being acquired by the toll gatherer.  If you have read Ken Follett's Pillars of the Earth, you will remember how important the bridge and the tolls were.


Ancestry.com can give you a summary of families with this last name (Brueggemann):
For example in the 1920 Census:
Illinois                    17-32 Families
Missouri                17-32 
Ohio                       6-16
Wisconsin              6-16
a handful of states had 1-5 and most didn't have any.

Take away the second "n" and the results are similar:

Illinois                    22-42
Missouri                22-42
Ohio                       8-21
Wisconsin             8-21

Friday, January 14, 2011

Some Brueggeman Siblings

I haven't posted a family picture in a while.  I am sharing a photo that came from Tom Riley.  I believe it was taken in 1968 at the reunion.


Thursday, January 13, 2011

From Selma's Diary Jan. 13, 1918

Mark Riley had this wonderful glimpse into the life of a young women 1917-1919.  Selma was taking business classes at the time so most of it was typed.  It was in interesting time in the world with WWI and the Spanish Influenza outbreak.  I  looked at what she wrote on this day in 1918. this is exactly what/how she wrote it:

Sunday, Jan 13, 1918
We went to church.  On the way home Cletus and Howard were on the street car for they were to tend to ordering their basketball suite for the boys.  Well, when I was getting on the street car Howard said he would be up tonight.  Cletus came over in the afternoon and stayed for supper, he said at the table he was to meet Howard at Long & Taylor at 6:30 o'clock so he made the suggestion that we go along and we could go to the early show.  Howard almost fell over when he saw us so we told him the reason we happened to be along.  We went to the Strand and they had the picture the "BLUE JEANS" which Viola Diana played the play was great but very pathetic and of course I had to cry, which Cletus and Howard both had to notice and later Cletus had to torment me about it but I should worry then we got some eats and made it for home, we went in the dining room where we had a good time.

I had to google Viola Diana and found her name to be Viola Dana.  She made her first movie in 1912 and her last in 1929.  She must have had a bad voice since she never made a "talkie".  "Blue Jeans" was made in 1917 so it took it a while to get to Akron.

The Strand Theater was relatively new when Selma saw pictures there.  This info is from Cinema Treasures:

The Strand Theatre opened on September 2, 1915 with "The Island of Regeneration". It was built for and operated by Maurice C. Winter, who had sold the Bank Theatre near Main & Market Street's to build the Strand Theatre.

Seating was provided for 857 in the orchestra and 350 in the balcony. It was equipped with a Moller pipe organ that was played by Katherine Bruot.

Taken over by Isaac and Jacob Silverman in 1918 after the death of Maurice C. Winter, it was taken over by Warner Bros. in 1929 and they remodeled the theatre.

With the downturn of business during the 1960's, the Strand Theatre went through several changes of management, closures and openings. In 1970, the Star Kay Theater Group of New York purchased the Stand Theatre and it became an adult cinema. Despite protests, it remained open and even escaped being closed down on moral grounds, by heavily self-censoring the films it screened. It closed in 1976 and became a concert club, with mainly jazz muscicians playing. This was short lived and by 1978 it was screening porn movies again, this time known as the Cascade Cinema. It was closed for good in 1986.

It was demolished in 1990 to make way for the $30 million Main Place building.

Wednesday, January 12, 2011

Ryley vs Riley

In the 1841 British Census and in earlier baptismal records of this family, the surname was spelled RYLEY vs. what we use today, RILEY.


Ryley is an English habitational name from Ryley in Lancashire, so named from Old English ryge ‘rye’ + leah‘wood’, ‘clearing’. There is a Riley with the same meaning in Devon, but it does not seem to have contributed to the surname, which is more common in northern England.  Most surnames are occupational or habitational in origin.  


In the 1841 Census. there were 462 people with the last name of RYLEY in Lancashire (the county where Manchester is located).  The county with the second most RYLEYs was Warwickshire (Birmingham).


It looks like most families had switched to RILEY by 1841 as there were 3699 RILEY individuals  in Lancashire and Yorkshire had 2270 people with RILEY.


By the 1851 Census, our family was using RILEY exclusively.

Tuesday, January 11, 2011

The Ryley/Riley Sisters: Milk Sellers

It appears that the women in Ezra Riley's family were Milk Sellers and/or Milk Dealers in Manchester.  You may not know this, we we are uncertain as to the parentage of Ezra.  A trade directory lists a Milk Seller named Ann Riley living at 7 George Leigh Street and during the 1841 Census there is an Ann Ryley living at this address but her occupation is listed as Shopkeeper.  If I had to guess, I think Ann was probably Ezra's mother.


A milk-dealer would probably buy the milk wholesale, then sell it direct to the consumer, or to shopkeepers.  Ann may have very well sold milk from their home since the census lists her as a shopkeeper.  There were other women in the household who may have also sold milk directly to the consumers.

Until the advent of railways, cows were kept in the city.  It was very common to find people having caught TB from drinking raw milk.


Monday, January 10, 2011

On this day in 1878

Anna Louise Brueggemann and August Hueseman were married on this day in 1878.  She was the daughter of Clamor.  She was born in Cleveland in 1859.  She was 18 years old when they married.  They settled in the St. Louis area and many of their descendants still live in the area.  


Anna and August went on to have eight children all born in St. Louis. 


I have emailed on of their descendants, John Hueseman, to see if he can provide additional info on Anna and August.

Sunday, January 9, 2011

Burial of Louis Henry Brueggeman

Louis was buried on this day.  He is buried at the Lutheran Cemetery in Cleveland, Section G, Lot 14.
Thanks to a volunteer from FindaGrave.com for this picture of his headstone.
 This stone is at the base of a larger stone with his father and mother on the reverse of the stone.  I am guessing that the larger stone is not original as it is not in the style of the day and Briueggeman is spelled with one "N".

He was also known as Ludwig Heinrich Brueggemann.  His funeral service was held at St. Luke's Lutheran Church, a German congregation.  I am not sure when they left Trinity for St. Luke's.




Saturday, January 8, 2011

Why are many of the genealogy resources related to the Mormons?

Many of the free resources available on the internet are sponsored by the Mormon Church (LDS) and many of the pay sites are owned/founded by members of the Church.  Ray once asked me "what's in it for them?"


They believe that many of their ancestors weren't able to know the message of their Church.  These ancestors are baptized by proxy into the Church.  In other words, these people are baptized into the Mormon Church regardless of their religious beliefs.  The Mormons believe that family ties are eternal and these ties can only be maintained if the ancestors are baptized.


We have occasionally come across a record on Ancestry.com where an LDS baptism has been recorded.  Next time we find one, I will share it with you here.


The Mormons have come under fire this practice.  At some point, many of the Holocaust victims were baptized by proxy.  As you can imagine, this raised quite a stink.  The Catholic Church has also raised concerned with the practice.  The official LDS website now states that by baptism, the ancestors are given the opportunity to hear "the word" and then they can make a "choice".







Friday, January 7, 2011

Akron Germania Newspaper

Ernst August Brueggemann left Zanesville in the fall of 1917 to work at the Germania Newspaper.  I am currently reseaching the paper and found the following information on another blog


At the age of 16, Paul E. Werner immigrated to America in 1867. He worked as a clerk and bookkeeper at several Akron stores. In 1873, Paul became an editorial writer for the Akron Germania newspaper. It was a popular German-language publication. He enjoyed it so much that he bought the newspaper a year later and became publisher. In the 1870s, Paul founded the Sunday Gazette and the Akron Tribune. He also began a commercial printing enterprize. In 1884, Paul quit the newspaper business and began making high-quality books. He built a printing plant in 1886 and built his sales offices all over the USA. Soon, he would have branches in 20-countries. Among the gold-leafed titles that the Werner Co. published in Akron were Webster's Dictionary, Encyclopaedia Britannica, Encyclopaedia Americana, the Waldorf Cook Book, the White House Cook Book and World's Best Literature. In the 1890s, the factory was producing 10,000 volumes a day. They would fill six train cars. Paul became friends with President William McKinley, Buffalo Bill Cody, French painter James Tissot, German Count Ferdinand Zeppelin and Queen Victoria. At the turn of the 20th century, Paul was hosting lavish gatherings at his Akron mansion. He was a multimillionaire. In 1904 he built Akron's German-American Music Hall. However, in 1908, Paul's fortune came to an end. Britannica filed suit alleging trademark violations. He was sued in all 20-countries where he did business. Paul hired a "dream team" of high profile lawyers and claimed victory in every suit. But the litigation cost him a fortune. In 1910, Paul's business collapsed. He filed bankruptcy and had to sell his 11-building Akron complex. Paul left Akron in 1915 to open a rubber company in Kansas City. But he lost his backing. That company folded in 1925. In 1927, next to broke, Paul returned to Akron and got a hero's welcome. Franklin A. Seiberling held a party for him at Stan Hywet Hall, Frank's Akron estate. Seiberling had bought the old Germania newspaper and gave it back to Paul. Paul Werner died of Bright's disease at the age of 80. Akron's elite packed the funeral.




EAB worked for the paper when Mr. Werner wasn't involved with the paper.  I am working on finding out about the paper during his tenure, I don't think the paper was active during World War I due to anti-German sentiment.

Thursday, January 6, 2011

On this day in 1922

Louis Henry (or Ludwig Heinrich) Brueggeman died.  He was the son on Clamor Victor Ludwig Brueggeman.  He was much younger than his father when he died.  He was only 60.  Louis was a tailor by trade.
Brueggemann, Louis H.
Date: January 6, 1922

Source: Source unknown;  Cleveland Necrology File, Reel #011.
Notes: Brueggemann-Louis H., beloved husband of Wilhelmina, January 6, 1922. Funeral Monday, January 9, at 2 p. m., from late residence and 2:30 p. m. from St. Luke's church, corner W. 85th street and Sauer avenue.

Wednesday, January 5, 2011

Free Resources on the Internet

One of my favorite sites available for research is FINDAGRAVE.COM.  It is a free site that helps you locate cemetery records. The site is totally dependent on volunteers so it's not complete.  You can locate the graves of famous people as well.  It is very simple to use, you just need to know the city and county that you are looking for.


Cemetery records and headstones can give you information that you may not have found otherwise.  Volunteers may even take a picture of a headstone for you.  It is a great resource for genealogical research.  You can also add information and pictures to share with others.


To search, use this link.  Enter as much information as you know and see what you find.  Remember, if you don't find someone it doesn't mean they aren't there.  That cemetery may not be indexed yet.


I searched Thomas Bowen Riley and this is what came up:


Thomas Bowen Riley
Birth Jan 15,1921
Death July 27, 1999
Maj, US Army
Riverside National Cemetery
Riverside
Riverside County
California, USA
Plot: 2A,0, 1196


There is no individual headstone photo but it give the plot info. I could post a request and maybe someone would take a picture for me.